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Christians Debating Issues

The Great Debate, Atheist and Christian Go head to head.<br />
How Old is the Earth? Debate between Hugh Ross verses Kent Hovind
Catholicism VS Protestantism DEBATE Justification
KJV Discussion Complete
Muslim vs. Christian Debate
The God Debate II: Harris vs. Craig
The Great Debate VIII: Is The Roman Catholic Priesthood Biblical & Ancient? (White vs Pacwa)
Was Peter The First Pope? DEBATE Martin vs Pacwa
United Pentecostals -VS- Christianity 1-10
Why Evangelical and Catholic Differences Matter
Walter Martin Bahai's vs. Christianity DEBATE
ASTROLOGY -vs- CHRISTIANITY
JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES VS CHRISTIANITY. JAMES WHITE VS GREG STAFFORD THE ENTIER DEBATE.
Ken Ham vs. Pat Robertson
1985 Debate: Oneness Pentecostal vs Trinitarian
Freemasonry - Dr. Walter Martin
God, Darwin or...Both? Part I
God, Darwin or...Both? Part II
God, Darwin or...Both? Part V (and last)
Catholicism VS Protestantism DEBATE Pope's Athority
The Great Debate on Science and the Bible
Now is the Time to Reach the World with the Gospel is Now - Part 8
Jones vs. Lewis Debate on Baptism
The Tribulation and the Rapture - Dr. Walter Martin (Historic Premillennial)
SILVA MIND CONTROL -VS- Christianity
Debate on Baptism
Is Jesus God?
Virgin Mary's 7 Steps to Godhood Via Catholic Dogma Exposed by "Bible Answer Man" Walter Martin
Mariology - Who is Mary according to Scripture?
Putting Creation to the Test. Dr. Hugh Ross and Dr. Fuz Rana at Purdue University
Genesis Debate
Christian view of Scientology - Dr. Walter Martin
God, Darwin or...Both? Part III
Seventh Day Adventist -VS- Christianity
Debate: Catholic vs Protestant - Catholicism and Evangelicalism - Scott Hahn vs Kenneth Samples
God, Darwin or...Both? Part IV
Jason Lisle
Dr. Lisle graduated
summa cum laude
from Ohio Wesleyan University where he double-majored in physics and astronomy, and minored in mathematics. He did graduate work at the University of Colorado where he earned a Master’s degree and a Ph.D. in Astrophysics. While there, Dr Lisle used the SOHO spacecraft to investigate motions on the surface of the sun as well as solar magnetism and subsurface weather. His thesis was entitled “Probing the Dynamics of Solar Supergranulation and its Interaction with Magnetism.” Among other things, he discovered a previously unknown polar alignment of supergranules (solar convection cells), and discovered evidence of solar giant cells. He has also authored a number of papers in both secular and creation literature.
Hugh Ross
At age seventeen he became the youngest person ever to serve as director of observations for Vancouver’s Royal Astronomical Society. With the help of a provincial scholarship and a National Research Council (NRC) of Canada fellowship, he completed his undergraduate degree in physics (University of British Columbia) and graduate degrees in astronomy (University of Toronto). The NRC also sent him to the United States for postdoctoral studies. At Caltech he researched quasi-stellar objects, or “quasars,” some of the most distant and ancient objects in the universe.
The Bible and the early church fathers
Jason Lisle
  • we take Genesis literally
  • the starting point of YEC is Scripture
  • the plain meaning of Scripture is that the earth was made in 6 24-hour days
  • science has to be interpreted in a way that fits a plain reading of Genesis 1
  • the evidence for an old universe and old Earth must be rejected a priori




Jason Lisle
  • there’s only 1 account of creation in the Bible: Genesis
  • the normal view in church history is 6 24-hour days
  • there are some early church fathers who that the days are long
  • the other places where creation is discussed are not real accounts



Jason Lisle
  • a Psalm is not written in the genre of historical narrative
  • Psalm 104 is not a creation account – it talks about ships, etc
  • it’s talking about the modern era, not a creation account

The evidence from science
Jason Lisle
  • if you pre-suppose my interpretation of Genesis, then the universe is young


Jason Lisle
  • if you pre-suppose my interpretation of Genesis, then the universe is young










Was the universe made with the appearance of age
Jason Lisle
  • any evidence for an old universe is wrong
  • stars didn’t form gradually, they were created by God instantly
  • stars have the appearance of age, but they’re actually young










Does nature provide us with knowledge about creation?
Jason Lisle
  • nature isn’t a book
  • nature doesn’t  provide knowledge about God
  • Psalm 19 doesn’t say that nature communicates to us
  • verse 3 says “There is no speech nor language”

Jason Lisle
  • You can’t take the Bible literally all the time























How important is the age of the Earth?

Jason Lisle
  • there was no death in the Garden of Eden, animal or human, before the Fall
  • the Bible says that death was a consequence of Adam’s sin
  • so there was no death before the Fall, according to the Bible
  • old earth people believe in death before the Fall
Consider
 
Romans 5:12

12. Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned—

Jason Lisle
  • I interpret the Bible to say that plants aren’t living creatures



What about dinosaurs, the Flood, and Noah’s ark?
Jason Lisle
  • dinosaurs were created on the 6th day
  • dinosaurs lived alongside humans and were vegetarians before the Fall
  • dinosaurs were on the Ark – they’re not that big – just take baby dinosaurs
  • it’s a global flood



The Bible and the early church fathers
Hugh Ross
  • we take Genesis literally
  • the Hebrew word for day (yom) can mean 24 hours or a long period of time
  • there are multiple creation accounts in the Bible
  • interpreting yom as long periods of time harmonizes all the accounts
  • the Bible says that the seventh day is not even ended
  • we believe in a literal Adam and Eve living thousands of years ago

Hugh Ross
  • the early church did not spend a lot of time talking about the age of the Earth
  • there is not unanimous agreement about the age of the Earth
  • there is no definitive statement on the age of the Earth until Isaac Newton
  • Newton strongly favored an old earth, hundreds of years before Darwin
  • there are other creation accounts, Job 38-39
  • Pslam 104 is a creation account








The evidence from science
Hugh Ross
  • both of us believe in an absolute beginning of time, space and matter
  • both of us believe that space is expanding now
  • stars form as matter coalesces during the expansion of the universe
  • star formation requires a universe aged on the order of billions of years

Hugh Ross
  • the speed of the expansion of the universe proves an old universe
  • the light emitted from the oldest stars also proves an old universe



Was the universe made with the appearance of age

Hugh Ross
  • God doesn’t lie in the Bible or in the book of nature
  • Scientists can look back in time by looking further out into the universe
  • Because light takes a long time to travel to the Earth, we can see the past
  • we can see a time when there were no stars yet
  • stars formed slowly over time, not instantaneously
  • we have photos of the universe before stars and after stars
  • we can see a history of the universe by looking closer and further away

Does nature provide us with knowledge about creation?
They discuss Psalm 19 now, so here’s
 
Psalm 19:1-5
1.  The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.
2.  Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge.
3.  There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard.
4.  Their voice goes out into all the earth,  their words to the ends of the world.
In the heavens he has pitched a tent for the sun,
5. which is like a bridegroom coming forth from his pavilion, like a champion rejoicing to run his course.

Hugh Ross
  • If you read all of verse 3, it says the exact opposite of what you just said it says
  • Verse 1: “The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands”
  • Verse 2: “Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge.”
  • Verse 3: “There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard.
  • Verse 4: “Their voice goes out into all the earth,  their words to the ends of the world.”


How important is the age of the Earth?
Hugh Ross
  • it’s a non-essential because it has nothing to do with salvation or inerrancy
  • both sides of the debate affirm the same views of salvation and inerrancy
  • professional scientists have multiple lines of evidence saying the universe is old
  • the only reason it matters is that young earth creationism is a barrier to faith
  • if you have to deny science to be a Christian, then it stops people from being saved
  • young earth opposition to science has been used by secularists to marginalize Christianity

Hugh Ross
  • Romans 5:12 says that Adam’s sin caused death to come to all men
  • old earth people believe that only animal death existed before the Fall, not human death
  • plant and animal death existed before the Fall – Adam and Eve were eating!

What about dinosaurs, the Flood, and Noah’s ark?
Hugh Ross
  • dinosaurs were created on the 5th day
  • they were extinct before before humans ever appeared
  • nobody in history ever wrote about dinosaurs until 200 years ago
  • it’s a local flood

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